| Alexis de Tocqueville on the U.S. election |
by DesertRat66 |
2008-01-15 09:04:28 |
"Above these [citizens] an immense tutelary power is elevated, which alone takes charge of assuring their enjoyments and watching over their fate. It is absolute, detailed, far-seeing, and mild. It would resemble paternal power if, like that, it had for its object to prepare men for manhood; but on the contrary, it seeks only to keep them fixed irrevocably in childhood; it likes citizens to enjoy themselves provided that they think only of enjoying themselves. It willingly works for their happiness; but it wants to be the unique agent and sole arbiter of that; it provides for their security, foresees and secures their needs, facilitates their pleasures, conducts their principal affairs, directs their industry, regulates their estates, divides their inheritances; can it not take away from them entirely the trouble of thinking and the pain of living? Subjection in small affairs manifests itself every day and makes itself felt without distinction by all citizens. It does not make them desperate, but it constantly thwarts them and brings them to renounce the use of their wills. Thus little by little, it extinguishes their spirits and enervates their souls." |
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[ Reply ] |
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And they say nothing good came out of France... :P (n/t) | by krikkert | 2008-01-15 09:15:40 |
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"Democracy in America" was required reading | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 09:27:15 |
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Democracy in America was a newfangled thing | by krikkert | 2008-01-15 09:30:02 |
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Bad krikkert!!! | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 09:32:42 |
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What? It was the obvious response! | by krikkert | 2008-01-15 09:33:58 |
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Yup, and red cowboys to boot! (n/t) | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 09:38:42 |
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Commie Cowboys? (n/t) | by psyop | 2008-01-15 09:47:58 |
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I hope so. (n/t) | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 09:48:24 |
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Not here, but yes in college. | by esbita | 2008-01-15 10:33:00 |
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Interesting. It was required in poli-sci 101 | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 12:35:29 |
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You're gonna laugh. | by esbita | 2008-01-15 13:14:18 |
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It's easier that way | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:33:58 |
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I take it this isn't recent enough to | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 09:49:28 |
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de Tocqueville is 1700s. (n/t) | by krikkert | 2008-01-15 09:53:21 |
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It is a warning | by DesertRat66 | 2008-01-15 09:57:32 |
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Meet Mr. Harrison Bergeron (n/t) | by lab rat | 2008-01-15 10:03:37 |
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Surrender of freedom to a tutelary power | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 10:22:49 |
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And you wonder why we're advocates... | by esbita | 2008-01-15 10:33:24 |
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Yes. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 10:40:54 |
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There is little benifit to a large government | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 10:57:47 |
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Wasn't that what the Roman Empire provided? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 12:33:53 |
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And where to Govt initiatives come from? (n/t) | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:05:02 |
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and look what happened to the Romans | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:21:00 |
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Their government became corrupt. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:23:08 |
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Your missing WHY it became corrupt | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:53:26 |
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Are you willing to allow a corrupt government? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:02:06 |
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I do speak out against it as do many | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:11:43 |
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Corruption is everywhere. It is NOT inherent | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:15:20 |
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For very very small systems. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:15:55 |
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no your right the coruption isnt in the system | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:20:46 |
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That is correct. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:27:30 |
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no its still coruption. | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:31:51 |
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Judging from the world around us... | by esbita | 2008-01-15 11:09:08 |
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I suspect we aren't likely to agree on this. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:33:53 |
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Oil and water, yes. | by esbita | 2008-01-15 13:56:19 |
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Maybe we live in different worlds then. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:01:11 |
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um, you mean like the recent posts you made | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:02:35 |
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You have me mistaken for someone else. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:21:34 |
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Indeed I do not have you mistaken for someone else (n/t) | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:22:59 |
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I expect that they should be adults | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:24:13 |
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You forgot egocentric (n/t) | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:25:10 |
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I thought all those things = egocentric. (n/t) | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:25:41 |
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hrm. i'll have to consider that, but you may have | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:29:07 |
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I'm sorry to hear that this is your experience. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:26:29 |
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No. too many people see this in too many | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:28:34 |
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Do I live in a better place than you? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:33:48 |
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You do not. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:35:04 |
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Your glass may be half empty. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:41:56 |
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My glass is very nearly full. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:45:02 |
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I had no idea you were a police man. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:58:46 |
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Which claim? | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:03:28 |
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Your claim that you stop people from taking | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:07:10 |
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Yes, and I do | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:10:07 |
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Are there a lot of attempts to take what is yours? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:19:53 |
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a lot, no. But some, yes. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:26:50 |
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What this thread needs is... | by swisscheese | 2008-01-15 17:46:31 |
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Every april 15th. (n/t) | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:32:14 |
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For what could be would require | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:49:53 |
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First 5 min of "Idiocracy" highlights that *well* (n/t) | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:51:18 |
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I really don't like that viewpoint. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:04:25 |
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I do see them as inevitable | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:10:22 |
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Are you kidding? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:24:26 |
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There is plenty of work, | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 15:30:28 |
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That sucks. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:44:20 |
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The various Governments the people voted in | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:46:18 |
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Points WAY WAY WAY up this thread | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:35:37 |
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No a good selective plauge would | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:34:26 |
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You live in a rather small town | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:39:56 |
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I live on an acreage. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:52:51 |
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Um, you do realise that most of the modern world | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:54:56 |
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How and where I live demonstrates that | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:10:16 |
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For now, yes. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:12:35 |
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your sample group is to small and homgenous then. (n/t) | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:12:56 |
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ok then you live in a MUCH smaller community | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:56:09 |
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Just what do you consider a small town? | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 15:13:56 |
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3000 (roughly Havre De Grace sized) | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:20:06 |
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IMO, those are not small towns. | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 15:24:19 |
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Not really gonna happen on the east coast till | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:37:00 |
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Same world, but not all of us wear blinders. | by esbita | 2008-01-15 15:56:26 |
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Same in an italian neighborhood and for | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:40:00 |
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Jefferson put his faith in a robust free press | by swisscheese | 2008-01-15 12:40:54 |
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That tells me why we need to ensure a | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:29:47 |
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Which only works when said press is responsible. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:07:02 |
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How would you propose ensuring a responsible | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:25:08 |
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I'd shoot irresponsible reports and editors. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:27:15 |
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That sounds like something worth pushing for. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:37:03 |
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I would. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:40:38 |
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libel law is so overwhelming a club... | by swisscheese | 2008-01-15 19:28:17 |
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Readers. Perhaps a self induced | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:40:48 |
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Id require news papers to be written on a | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:32:19 |
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I'd start by limiting ownership concentration | by swisscheese | 2008-01-15 19:16:49 |
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NO WAY!! We are responsible | by manatee | 2008-01-15 15:09:23 |
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Common sense isn't. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:15:22 |
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I applaud the rag sheets they are the ultimate | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 15:22:15 |
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Think of it from a Fred Brooks perspective | by hobbs | 2008-01-15 13:22:25 |
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Please tell me how that explains the | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:26:50 |
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Beacuse, | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 13:34:12 |
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How is that again? | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:39:57 |
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Large == inefficent | by Sterling_Ag | 2008-01-15 13:53:23 |
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You make no sense. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:59:24 |
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VERY much so. | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:09:48 |
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Share holders are different from voters. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:32:12 |
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You're talking about only 1 type of shareholder | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:35:49 |
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Goverments have other concerns than effeiciency | by swisscheese | 2008-01-15 19:52:05 |
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As long as the shareholders stay happy | by Sterling_Ag | 2008-01-15 14:12:57 |
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Large companies take advantage of | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:19:03 |
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If it is inefficient, it has to be because it is | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:47:54 |
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Because not enough people give a damn | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 15:54:26 |
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The source of the revenue is the problem. | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 14:00:39 |
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The source of the revenue doesn't matter. | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 14:18:59 |
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most stockholders do not get that involved with | by subbywan | 2008-01-15 14:24:23 |
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I have seen it get a lot worse since | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:13:35 |
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What you're missing is that | by Sterling_Ag | 2008-01-15 14:25:24 |
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Good point! | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 15:50:34 |
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And the government should provide | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 19:43:10 |
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Nope the theory is just fine.. | by Sterling_Ag | 2008-01-15 13:45:48 |
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Heh. Sounds like you have experienced | by Peace_man | 2008-01-15 13:52:28 |
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Not true at all. | by lheggland | 2008-01-15 14:04:47 |
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VERY not true. | by joecrouse | 2008-01-15 14:43:21 |
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Because large government exists | by hobbs | 2008-01-15 15:28:07 |